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Do You Agree Or Not

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  • Little Red Rouster, Lancaster
    started a topic Do You Agree Or Not

    Do You Agree Or Not

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ris-johnson-vn

    Should Boris follow Hillary Clinton's advise or ???????

  • Topdeck, London
    replied
    Originally posted by carol, welwyn garden city View Post
    I don't think it helps that the vaccine is not stopping anyone catching the virus either.

    I know far more people with covid now, all of them double jabbed, and the dozen or so I know not vaccinated, have all been fine.

    They need to be telling peoplehow many of the 8000 or so in hospital, have not been jabbed and how poorly they are. The vaccine take up has been good, but there are a lot of people with doubts out there .................................................C arol

    Already posted on another thread is data on vaccine effectiveness and this is only one source there are other.

    From the latest.

    Several studies of vaccine effectiveness have been conducted in the UK which indicate that 2 doses of vaccine are between 65 and 95% effective at preventing symptomatic disease with COVID-19 with the Delta variant, with higher levels of protection against severe disease including hospitalisation and death. There is some evidence of waning of protection against infection and symptomatic disease over time, though protection against severe disease remains high in most groups at least 5 months after the second dose.

    Results
    The rate of a positive COVID-19 test varies by age and vaccination status.

    The rate of a positive COVID-19 test is substantially lower in vaccinated individuals compared to unvaccinated individuals up to the age of 29.

    In individuals aged greater than 30, the rate of a positive COVID-19 test is higher in vaccinated individuals compared to unvaccinated.
    This is likely to be due to a variety of reasons, including differences in the population of vaccinated and unvaccinated people as well as differences in testing patterns.

    The rate of hospitalisation within 28 days of a positive COVID-19 test increases with age, and is substantially greater in unvaccinated individuals compared to vaccinated individuals.

    The rate of death within 28 days or within 60 days of a positive COVID-19 test increases with age, and again is substantially greater in unvaccinated individuals compared to fully vaccinated individuals.
    the are a lot of caveats to the data in particular the the older age groups and the vulnerable groups(more likely to get sick) where proportion of vaccinated is very high.


    https://www.gov.uk/government/public...llance-reports

    for a more general overview.

    https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulat...latestinsights


    Leave a comment:


  • carol, welwyn garden city
    replied
    So this is from someone I know on Facebook that she shared.


    ​​​​​​

    Leave a comment:


  • carol, welwyn garden city
    replied
    I don't think it helps that the vaccine is not stopping anyone catching the virus either.

    I know far more people with covid now, all of them double jabbed, and the dozen or so I know not vaccinated, have all been fine.

    They need to be telling people how many of the 8000 or so in hospital, have not been jabbed and how poorly they are. The vaccine take up has been good, but there are a lot of people with doubts out there .................................................C arol

    Leave a comment:


  • Issyalex, Glasgow
    replied
    Originally posted by andyn, Bucks View Post

    Think the issue would be many patients that have not been offered the vaccine (paediatrics, under 15s) and pregnant women who have also not had the vaccine.

    So someone turns up and has not been vaccinated they will be refused treatment.....not going to happen. Same as if I am the patient, I will not be requiring any proof of vaccination before I let them treat me.
    Yes the issues are there but people want all NHS and care staff to be vaccinated so do they not deserve the same curtesy? of course they are not going by the government.

    Pregnant woman have been offered the vaccine as have 12-15 year olds.

    Emergency admissions be it adult or child will be tested for covid as they are now but if they’ve to be admitted should they be made to have the vaccine? No of course they won’t so why does the powers to be think that the staff should be? There cannot be one rule for some and another rule for others.

    like you if I was an inpatient I wouldn’t need or want to know what staff were unvaccinated. Everyone has a choice but as long as it’s an educated choice and not an internet or listening to friends choice.

    Leave a comment:


  • Issyalex, Glasgow
    replied
    Originally posted by Topdeck, London View Post

    Read your own post again.



    Once born they are a patient and many children would have to be denied care.

    Once you accept exception s you open the door.

    ​​​​​​
    Hasn’t the government done that? Doing away with masks and social distancing?

    Leave a comment:


  • Topdeck, London
    replied
    Originally posted by Issyalex, Glasgow View Post

    Why is it a problem? If the powers to be want all NHS staff vaccinated then it goes for everyone.

    In maternity wards the new born baby should be covid free. In paediatrics patients ages range from birth to 18 but sometimes 21. The older patients can have the vaccine. If parents haven’t had the vaccine then a family member could stay with them or in my day there were no parents staying all day or overnight. Just normal visiting hours.
    Read your own post again.

    If vaccines to be made mandatory for NHS and care home staff then they need to be made mandatory for all Patients and visitors.
    Once born they are a patient and many children would have to be denied care.

    Once you accept exception s you open the door.

    ​​​​​​

    Leave a comment:


  • andyn, Bucks
    replied
    Originally posted by Issyalex, Glasgow View Post

    Why is it a problem? If the powers to be want all NHS staff vaccinated then it goes for everyone.

    In maternity wards the new born baby should be covid free. In paediatrics patients ages range from birth to 18 but sometimes 21. The older patients can have the vaccine. If parents haven’t had the vaccine then a family member could stay with them or in my day there were no parents staying all day or overnight. Just normal visiting hours.
    Think the issue would be many patients that have not been offered the vaccine (paediatrics, under 15s) and pregnant women who have also not had the vaccine.

    So someone turns up and has not been vaccinated they will be refused treatment.....not going to happen. Same as if I am the patient, I will not be requiring any proof of vaccination before I let them treat me.

    Leave a comment:


  • Issyalex, Glasgow
    replied
    Originally posted by smtcan, Scarborough View Post



    Over here there is an exemption for those with legitimate reasons not to be vaccinated and there are only two reasons accepted.

    The first would be an allergic reaction to a component of the vaccine within an individual, which must be confirmed by an allergist or immunologist.
    The second would be if an individual suffered myocarditis or pericarditis after the first dose of a vaccine.
    Initially there were many claims of exemption on religious grounds, but leaders of many faiths have stood up to say there is no reason in their creed to resist vaccination.

    Employees claiming these exemptions must be tested every three days.

    Visiting in hospitals is very limited and proof of vaccination is required. Husband had surgery recently and was allowed only one vaccinated visitor each day, for one hour. Adult non surgical patients cannot have visitors, unless they are end of life patients. Labour and delivery is limited to one support person.

    Of course we have anti vaccine zealots, but generally the regulations are regarded to be for the good of the community at large, and cases are dropping quite quickly. This system works for us, but might not be appropriate for UK.

    BTW, i agree that it has nothing to do with Hilary Clinton, or any other American. They need to get their own house in order before presuming to advise anyone else.

    Sheila
    Hi Sheila you seem to have a good regulations which are trying to protect everyone.

    Leave a comment:


  • Issyalex, Glasgow
    replied
    Originally posted by Topdeck, London View Post

    A bit of a problem for paediatrics and maternity.
    Why is it a problem? If the powers to be want all NHS staff vaccinated then it goes for everyone.

    In maternity wards the new born baby should be covid free. In paediatrics patients ages range from birth to 18 but sometimes 21. The older patients can have the vaccine. If parents haven’t had the vaccine then a family member could stay with them or in my day there were no parents staying all day or overnight. Just normal visiting hours.

    Leave a comment:


  • smtcan, Scarborough
    replied
    Originally posted by Issyalex, Glasgow View Post
    First of all what’s it got to do with Hilary Clinton?

    I understand why the general public want NHS and care staff vaccinated but There are many reasons why people cannot get the vaccine and nursing and care home staff have allergy’s/illness. Vaccines have never been mandatory for the general public so why should it be for NHS and care staff?

    My hubby and BIL are all for mandatory vaccines for care staff but if they were we’d loose so many good caring staff with a wealth of experience.


    Over here there is an exemption for those with legitimate reasons not to be vaccinated and there are only two reasons accepted.

    The first would be an allergic reaction to a component of the vaccine within an individual, which must be confirmed by an allergist or immunologist.
    The second would be if an individual suffered myocarditis or pericarditis after the first dose of a vaccine.
    Initially there were many claims of exemption on religious grounds, but leaders of many faiths have stood up to say there is no reason in their creed to resist vaccination.

    Employees claiming these exemptions must be tested every three days.

    Visiting in hospitals is very limited and proof of vaccination is required. Husband had surgery recently and was allowed only one vaccinated visitor each day, for one hour. Adult non surgical patients cannot have visitors, unless they are end of life patients. Labour and delivery is limited to one support person.

    Of course we have anti vaccine zealots, but generally the regulations are regarded to be for the good of the community at large, and cases are dropping quite quickly. This system works for us, but might not be appropriate for UK.

    BTW, i agree that it has nothing to do with Hilary Clinton, or any other American. They need to get their own house in order before presuming to advise anyone else.

    Sheila

    Leave a comment:


  • Topdeck, London
    replied
    Originally posted by Issyalex, Glasgow View Post

    Exactly Annie. If vaccines to be made mandatory for NHS and care home staff then they need to be made mandatory for all Patients and visitors.
    A bit of a problem for paediatrics and maternity.

    Leave a comment:


  • All at sea, Yorks
    replied
    Weren’t we in a similar position last Autumn with scientific and medical experts telling the government to do something....and still they dithered? I recall a two week firebreak being suggested. This time we’re just asking for a mask mandate and good messaging from the government whilst yet coping with an even more virulent form of the virus. Which is why I can’t understand why those NHS workers not wanting all the protection they can get.
    Last edited by All at sea, Yorks; 25th October 2021, 02:13 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Issyalex, Glasgow
    replied
    Originally posted by annie, Glasgow View Post

    SJ's comments are JMO an attempt to distract us from the bigger questions of re-introducing masks etc Vaccination is NOT the only tool in the box.

    BTW if the government insists that all NHS and Care staff must be fully vaccinated, will they apply a similar policy to all patients who present themselves for treatment?

    FWIW HC should butt out.

    Annie
    Exactly Annie. If vaccines to be made mandatory for NHS and care home staff then they need to be made mandatory for all Patients and visitors.

    Leave a comment:


  • Issyalex, Glasgow
    replied
    First of all what’s it got to do with Hilary Clinton?

    I understand why the general public want NHS and care staff vaccinated but There are many reasons why people cannot get the vaccine and nursing and care home staff have allergy’s/illness. Vaccines have never been mandatory for the general public so why should it be for NHS and care staff?

    My hubby and BIL are all for mandatory vaccines for care staff but if they were we’d loose so many good caring staff with a wealth of experience.

    Leave a comment:


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