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  1. #81
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    Quote QUOTE: View Post
    .................................................. ............................

    South east, of course, is predominently 'Thatcher land' whose matriarch was the disciple of selfishness and greed and who, I believe, proclaimed that 'there was no such thing as community/society' and set about proving her point by allowing mounted police officers to perform a 'charge of the light brigade' into innocent and legally demonstrating striking coal miners at the Orgreave colliery 'up north,' many of whom suffered serious injuries at the hands of 'over-zealous' police officers and where Mr Arthur Scargill, leader of the NUM, was roughly man-handled away into a police vehicle.

    Result, pit closed, jobs lost, union busted, community destroyed, local morale destroyed, families suffered, marriages broken up, imported inferior foreign coal, shortage of brass bands and male voice choirs.

    Reward? self-appointed Baroness with line continued and passed on to her family, for doing what?

    Consolation, her 'colleagues' saw sense, and the once 'iron lady' was kicked-out of Downing Street, (tearfully) to which thousands of others, made redundant, as a consequence of her 'reign,' rejoiced, as she once encouraged us all to do from the steps of 10 Downing Street, by adopting a pompous quasi-religious style, subsequent to the sinking of the Belgrano warship, during the Falklands conflict.

    .................................................. ......................................

    I suppose that I may now look forward to the odd reply from her brood of young 'Thatcherites' most of whom, I suspect, 'earn' their living in the financial sector of 'the city.'

    Gordon Rhys-Williams (of Wales)
    Well my dear Gordy, here we are in total agreement. Amazing!

    cheers
    Harvey
    (Living in the Home Counties.)


  2. #82
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    Always lived down here, I always thought Thatcher was thoroughly evil. There were mines in Kent too, & as a printer living near the docks she had it in for all of us.


  3. #83
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    ...and the Brass bands play.

    Quote QUOTE: View Post
    Could it be 'middle' England, the area beloved of politicians who attempt to coax it's electorate by political persuasion into joining their party.

    We know the south west is seafood and cider country and, incidentally, used to be part of the Celtic nation (Wales) further north.

    South east, of course, is predominently 'Thatcher land' whose matriarch was the disciple of selfishness and greed and who, I believe, proclaimed that 'there was no such thing as community/society' and set about proving her point by allowing mounted police officers to perform a 'charge of the light brigade' into innocent and legally demonstrating striking coal miners at the Orgreave colliery 'up north,' many of whom suffered serious injuries at the hands of 'over-zealous' police officers and where Mr Arthur Scargill, leader of the NUM, was roughly man-handled away into a police vehicle.

    Result, pit closed, jobs lost, union busted, community destroyed, local morale destroyed, families suffered, marriages broken up, imported inferior foreign coal, shortage of brass bands and male voice choirs.

    Reward? self-appointed Baroness with line continued and passed on to her family, for doing what?

    Consolation, her 'colleagues' saw sense, and the once 'iron lady' was kicked-out of Downing Street, (tearfully) to which thousands of others, made redundant, as a consequence of her 'reign,' rejoiced, as she once encouraged us all to do from the steps of 10 Downing Street, by adopting a pompous quasi-religious style, subsequent to the sinking of the Belgrano warship, during the Falklands conflict.

    God's own country, as described, is slightly off-track, it actually begins at Ynys-Mon (Mona's Isle - otherwise Anglesey) and proceeds in a southerly direction, through Snowdonia and terminating in the Cardiff area of the Principality of Wales.

    I suppose that I may now look forward to the odd reply from her brood of young 'Thatcherites' most of whom, I suspect, 'earn' their living in the financial sector of 'the city.'

    Gordon Rhys-Williams (of Wales)
    Good morning Gordon and a happy Father's Day.

    I suppose that I may now look forward to the odd reply from her brood of young 'Thatcherites' most of whom, I suspect, 'earn' their living in the financial sector of 'the city.'

    I don't know about 'young Thatcherites' Gordon, but here's one of her 'older' Praetorian Guard. Now, where shall I start?

    ...by allowing mounted police officers to perform a 'charge of the light brigade' into innocent and legally demonstrating striking coal miners...... and who were armed with all sorts of projectiles and were breaking the law by engaging in 'secondary picketing' and, in many cases,endangering life.

    ...many of whom suffered serious injuries at the hands of 'over-zealous' police officers... I wonder where they were recruited then? Surely not the working class areas.

    ...and where Mr Arthur Scargill, leader of the NUM, was roughly man-handled away into a police vehicle.

    Obviously not roughly enough: he's still going. Interesting to see he is currently threatening to sue his old union, the NUM. His extraordinary threat comes at a time when Mr Scargill is under fire from NUM colleagues for continuing to charge the union 33,000 a year to pay for rent and running costs of a three-bedroom apartment in London. Really, that's the equivalent of a lot of cruises.

    Now Gordon, while we are on the subject of Miners, when did Nottinghamshire move South?

    Or, more to the point, perhaps you may explain where, in the North, South,East or West, does Nottingham lie. I just seem to have some recollection that it was the Nottinghamshire miners who, because they refused to strike, were subjected to outrageous intimidation, threats and assaults by your innocent 'band of brothers'?

    Consolation, her 'colleagues' saw sense, and the once 'iron lady' was kicked-out of Downing Street,

    Surely you mean 'stabbed in the back' following the sacking of Geoffrey Howe: he of 'like being mauled by a dead sheep' fame; in cahoots with that renowned self publicist, Michael 'Tarzan' Heseltine.

    ...by adopting a pompous quasi-religious style, subsequent to the sinking of the Belgrano warship, during the Falklands conflict.

    Tough military decision in my book, and one which more than likely saved many British lives. I thought the only person to dispute the sinking was the now retired and well known 'expenses fraudster', Tam Dalyell.

    On a lighter note,...We know the south west is seafood and cider country and, incidentally, used to be part of the Celtic nation (Wales) further north...You forgot to mention Ambrosia. Oh, arghh.

    Back to reality then. Margaret Thatcher, whether you liked her or not, rescued this fine country from the disastrous policies of Harold Wilson and James Callaghan: remember the winter of discontent? Her children were those who took the opportunities afforded by her policies, particularly the 'right to buy'. Those who neither recognised the opportunities, nor, through lack of ambition or motivation, availed themselves, are her only detractors. Again, interestingly, history appears to be repeating itself in the post Gordon Brown era.

    I trust my missive hasn't spoilt your Father's day. Now, I'm off to lunch.

    Last edited by Solent Richard, Lee on the Solent; 20th June 2010 at 12:18 PM. Reason: missed a comma

  4. #84
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    Notwithstanding the politics of the era, as someone who grew up on the Notts/Derbys borders at the time of the miners strike I have to say that there was the best and worst of behaviour on both sides ie, the miners and the police. It cannot be simplified into a battle of good v evil.

    To be a little political too, it was said that Arthur Scargill entered the era with a large union and a small house and finished with a large house and a small union.

    I know people involved in these disputes and it wasn't pretty. There are still families who won't speak to each other because one half broke the strike. There are also villages that used to be prosperous that are now on their knees through lack of jobs in the area. Dark days in the history of the Midlands.

    Cruising my way through life!

    Sue

  5. #85
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    Good morning Gordon and a happy Father's Day.

    I suppose that I may now look forward to the odd reply from her brood of young 'Thatcherites' most of whom, I suspect, 'earn' their living in the financial sector of 'the city.'

    I don't know about 'young Thatcherites' Gordon, but here's one of her 'older' Praetorian Guard. Now, where shall I start?

    ...by allowing mounted police officers to perform a 'charge of the light brigade' into innocent and legally demonstrating striking coal miners...... and who were armed with all sorts of projectiles and were breaking the law by engaging in 'secondary picketing' and, in many cases,endangering life.

    ...many of whom suffered serious injuries at the hands of 'over-zealous' police officers... I wonder where they were recruited then? Surely not the working class areas.

    ...and where Mr Arthur Scargill, leader of the NUM, was roughly man-handled away into a police vehicle.

    Obviously not roughly enough: he's still going. Interesting to see he is currently threatening to sue his old union, the NUM. His extraordinary threat comes at a time when Mr Scargill is under fire from NUM colleagues for continuing to charge the union 33,000 a year to pay for rent and running costs of a three-bedroom apartment in London. Really, that's the equivalent of a lot of cruises.

    Now Gordon, while we are on the subject of Miners, when did Nottinghamshire move South?

    Or, more to the point, perhaps you may explain where, in the North, South,East or West, does Nottingham lie. I just seem to have some recollection that it was the Nottinghamshire miners who, because they refused to strike, were subjected to outrageous intimidation, threats and assaults by your innocent 'band of brothers'?

    Consolation, her 'colleagues' saw sense, and the once 'iron lady' was kicked-out of Downing Street,

    Surely you mean 'stabbed in the back' following the sacking of Geoffrey Howe: he of 'like being mauled by a dead sheep' fame; in cahoots with that renowned self publicist, Michael 'Tarzan' Heseltine.

    ...by adopting a pompous quasi-religious style, subsequent to the sinking of the Belgrano warship, during the Falklands conflict.

    Tough military decision in my book, and one which more than likely saved many British lives. I thought the only person to dispute the sinking was the now retired and well known 'expenses fraudster', Tam Dalyell.

    On a lighter note,...We know the south west is seafood and cider country and, incidentally, used to be part of the Celtic nation (Wales) further north...You forgot to mention Ambrosia. Oh, arghh.

    Back to reality then. Margaret Thatcher, whether you liked her or not, rescued this fine country from the disastrous policies of Harold Wilson and James Callaghan: remember the winter of discontent? Her children were those who took the opportunities afforded by her policies, particularly the 'right to buy'. Those who neither recognised the opportunities, nor, through lack of ambition or motivation, availed themselves, are her only detractors. Again, interestingly, history appears to be repeating itself in the post Gordon Brown era.

    I trust my missive hasn't spoilt your Father's day. Now, I'm off to lunch.
    Morning Richard
    You could have saved yourself the time, Richard, and just posted another page of the Daily Mail (doesn't matter which page). We could have inferred all the above just by establishing you read that paper.

    Incidentally, isn't it facing both ways to espouse patriotism as you do and at the same time to fund the Rothermere family? Or do you agree with them that Hitler would have been received as 'Adolf the Great'' had he crossed the channel in 1939?

    As to the meat of your comments, you touch a nerve when you talk about a subject you clearly know little about. For the communities that suffered then, and still do now, it's nothing to do with the strike or it's leader's mistakes. It's the calculation of the government of the time that these thousands of people were somehow disposable. That they could be cast aside as acceptable casualties in a much bigger and more important battle is what animates people still, and the fact that views like yours persist shows how important that memory is. If you doubt it, how could the Conservatives, in the midst of the deepest and most severe recession in decades, and against a government as unpopular as was Brown's, fail so dismally. They couldn't even get elected in those circumstances! The reason is because millions of us recall what happened last time - it really is that totemic an issue.

    And finally, why is the public sector such a bad thing until we talk about the military and the absurdly generous pensions enjoyed by retired officers? Then it becomes a reward for years of dedicated service, but if we're talking about school caretakers or bin-men it's money we can't afford? There is a rude awakening to come for sure.


  6. #86
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    Hi Canberra.
    Not me,,i was quoting a comment on review page
    I believe these mini-cruises are becoming Hen/Stag do's
    JC
    I got the impression it was a comment made by yourself rather than a comment on a review page!

    Obviously the person who made the coment is talking out of there

    Yes your correct as alot of ex UK mini cruises do attact alot of hen/stag partys as well as alot of first time cruisers!

    On the Independence of the Seas for the 19th June there was a total of 4121 passengers, 667 of these were aged 1-20 years old and the passenger total included 397 US Passengers along with upto 28 other different nationalities so a very broad mix of passengers I would say especially considering it is not school hoildays yet!

    Last edited by Canberra, Southampton; 21st June 2010 at 11:41 AM. Reason: missed a sentence

  7. #87
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    Well my dear Gordy, here we are in total agreement. Amazing!

    cheers
    Harvey
    (Living in the Home Counties.)
    Hi Harvey

    You don't live in the home Counties, you live the other side of the 'Jordan' and within sight of 'the Promised Land,' Cymru.

    And so to 'tackle' a brainwashed Thatcherite who, as you can imagine, is one of this dramatic acressess' shallow followers.

    Actress, Mrs T Bouddica atop a British tank, wearing Lawrence of Arabia headgear and goggles - only lacking Brittania's shield and trident for effect, during a 'visit' to 'rally the troops' fighting the Gulf War, the bill for which we are still saddled with, for what, oil? no the Yanks got that, but we still retain 'the special relationship.'

    But do not dispair, George Orwell, oops sorry, George Osbourne and his millionaire mates will put that right tomorrow, emergency budget day, and who will cop for 'the painful measures to rescue the economy,' well who else, the many - not the few?

    Cheers
    Gordon


  8. #88
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    Hi Harvey

    You don't live in the home Counties, you live the other side of the 'Jordan' and within sight of 'the Promised Land,' Cymru.

    .................................................. .............................................

    Cheers
    Gordon
    My dear Gordy
    I DO know where I live and it is definitely in the Home Counties. (My Forum place of residence refers to my daily tipple of "Harveys Bristol Cream")

    cheers
    Harvey


  9. #89
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    Good morning Gordon and a happy Father's Day.

    I suppose that I may now look forward to the odd reply from her brood of young 'Thatcherites' most of whom, I suspect, 'earn' their living in the financial sector of 'the city.'

    I don't know about 'young Thatcherites' Gordon, but here's one of her 'older' Praetorian Guard. Now, where shall I start?

    ...by allowing mounted police officers to perform a 'charge of the light brigade' into innocent and legally demonstrating striking coal miners...... and who were armed with all sorts of projectiles and were breaking the law by engaging in 'secondary picketing' and, in many cases,endangering life.

    ...many of whom suffered serious injuries at the hands of 'over-zealous' police officers... I wonder where they were recruited then? Surely not the working class areas.

    ...and where Mr Arthur Scargill, leader of the NUM, was roughly man-handled away into a police vehicle.

    Obviously not roughly enough: he's still going. Interesting to see he is currently threatening to sue his old union, the NUM. His extraordinary threat comes at a time when Mr Scargill is under fire from NUM colleagues for continuing to charge the union 33,000 a year to pay for rent and running costs of a three-bedroom apartment in London. Really, that's the equivalent of a lot of cruises.

    Now Gordon, while we are on the subject of Miners, when did Nottinghamshire move South?

    Or, more to the point, perhaps you may explain where, in the North, South,East or West, does Nottingham lie. I just seem to have some recollection that it was the Nottinghamshire miners who, because they refused to strike, were subjected to outrageous intimidation, threats and assaults by your innocent 'band of brothers'?

    Consolation, her 'colleagues' saw sense, and the once 'iron lady' was kicked-out of Downing Street,

    Surely you mean 'stabbed in the back' following the sacking of Geoffrey Howe: he of 'like being mauled by a dead sheep' fame; in cahoots with that renowned self publicist, Michael 'Tarzan' Heseltine.

    ...by adopting a pompous quasi-religious style, subsequent to the sinking of the Belgrano warship, during the Falklands conflict.

    Tough military decision in my book, and one which more than likely saved many British lives. I thought the only person to dispute the sinking was the now retired and well known 'expenses fraudster', Tam Dalyell.

    On a lighter note,...We know the south west is seafood and cider country and, incidentally, used to be part of the Celtic nation (Wales) further north...You forgot to mention Ambrosia. Oh, arghh.

    Back to reality then. Margaret Thatcher, whether you liked her or not, rescued this fine country from the disastrous policies of Harold Wilson and James Callaghan: remember the winter of discontent? Her children were those who took the opportunities afforded by her policies, particularly the 'right to buy'. Those who neither recognised the opportunities, nor, through lack of ambition or motivation, availed themselves, are her only detractors. Again, interestingly, history appears to be repeating itself in the post Gordon Brown era.

    I trust my missive hasn't spoilt your Father's day. Now, I'm off to lunch.
    It is difficult to know where to begin in addressing a thoroughly brainwashed and biased disciple of Thatcher, and her gospel of greed and self.

    Mrs T assumed the throne of 10 Downing Street bearing a jealousy of Ted Heath and with a determination to destroy the British Unions, and with an equal determination of emulating, nay - surpassing the wartime leadership qualities and toughness of Winston Churchill - that's one of the reasons for ordering the sinking of the Belgrano, sailing OUTSIDE the 200 mile restricted zone - it was more a PR exercise rather than a threat to 'our boys.'

    Whether Orgreave Colliery is in the Midlands or the North, it certainly is not in the South, but is symbolic as in reference (in the hymn) to "Jerusalem the Golden" whilst not referring to the actual Jerusalem, being rather a yearning for something better.

    Orgreave is a name etched in history that will be forever associated with the class system, and its divisions, still prevalent in the UK and the lengths that the 'democratic' system, in the wrong hands, will go to in order to get its own way in exercising control over people.

    You ask where the police officers, delegated to carry out this obnoxious instruction, were recruited from and as you suggest "not from a working class community."

    You're right, I was in the company of a former police officer who was 'not from the north or midlands, he lived further south (at the time) and hinted that the 'job' was a buit of extra overtime for the 'Met' and maybe others swapping khaki uniform for blue.

    Orgreave is a symbolic reference to encompass many situations where brute force was seen as the only solution to 'an inconvenient problem.'

    The same situation as that existed during the 1920's - 30's where striking Welsh coal miners, for a paltry few shillings and safer working conditions, were not only starved into submission, but the Home Secretary then, Mr Winston Churchill MP, called in the Army with the threat of matching discontent with bullets.

    These were the same men, later recruited and conscripted into the armed forces, to fight for King and Country who, even if they did survive the bullet, would only receive a similar reward to that of a life spent hewing coal and ruining their health working in a black hole, oh! and yes, they got a medal.

    He (Churchill) was siding with the colliery owners who couldn't give a toss for safety measures, as they well knew that they would get away lightly, as in the enquiry into the Gresford, Wrexham pit disaster where hundreds of miners were gassed, burned or suffocated to death and because rescue teams could not save them in an underground explosion caused by the ineptitude and greed of the owners who got off lightly with a token compensation package awarded to the bereaved families.

    The managers were not unduly reprimanded and I believe the accident was regarded as unanticipated and the usual result of an 'act of God.'

    The souls of those stricken miners are forever incarcerated in their deathly tomb and whose only memorial is the same winding wheel that plunged them daily into a wet, dusty, dank black abyss, which is mounted on a concrete plinth near the scene of their last view of life, now converted into an industrial estate.

    Your insinuation, that the Orgreave miners were nothing short of a load of thugs armed with offensive weapons, is not only a lie but not supported by any evidence, unless you happened to search one of them.

    There probably was a mixture of good and bad strikers who, lets face it, were not going to stand mutely there, devoid of anything to defend themselves against heavy police batons and charging horses.

    Yes there were faults on both sides, it could have been handled better by the Government, and as for your suggestion that the strikers were augmented by other 'coached-in' supporters, the same tit-for-tat situation was applicable to the Police who called in the 'Cavalry' from other forces resulting in 'over-kill.'

    Margaret Thatcher, when she wasn't 'licking the backside' of Ronald Reagan, was handbag on wrist, setting about establishing her place in history by any means and of course anticipating her enoblement which title she also ensured would be passed on to her siblings, one of whom is incapable of reading a road map, getting lost in a now famous car rally incident, and getting mixed-up recently with 'bad company.'

    Her 'removal' from office was not down to being 'dressed down' by a senior colleague, whose bite was regarded as fierce as that of an angry sheep, he just told her, and us, that her Presidential style had no place in democratic British Politics, the same happened to Tony Blair, only with less consequences, but he's still doing nicely, thank you.

    What is Margaret Thatcher's legacy? not for anything beneficial to ordinary members of the British Public that's for sure, maybe her well-heeled friends, predominantly wealthy ones.

    The whole fabric of our former society (which she claimed does not exist) has been changed forever for the worst.
    By her insatiable lust for power over others and her quest for self enhancement, she has virtually destroyed several normally secure communities, she may be fondly remembered by the likes of you for her jack-boot policy and this contrived 'iron-lady' tag and, the actress coming out again speech, describing herself as 'the lady's not for turning,' tags I feel sure she revelled in.

    The anti Scargill argument and his alleged 'expenses' is a bit rich coming, as it does, in the wake of the MP's expenses scandal when the gullible public have had to pick up the tab for 'expenses' such as floating duck houses and mortgages on 'second' homes, yes they ARE all as bad as each other and the only mitigating factor to come out of the last general election, is that the Lib Dem's of the coalition may have a mollifying influence on the suave Cameron and wealthy company.

    Coming, as I do from a 'working-class' society (an appropriate designation by a middle or upper class society) although, misquoting Mrs T, there's no such thing as 'working class' (see unemployment figures) and most of the others 'work' in 'essential' occupations such as 'financial advisors' or 'consultants,' 'property developers' or 'something in the city' where they are unlikely to get their hands dirty, just their reputations possibly tarnished yet unaffected by the financial repercussions suffered by 'ordinary' families.

    Your loyalty to your former leader is, I suppose, commendable but misguided and contrary to the opinions of, I suspect, the majority.

    Gordon Rhys-Williams


  10. #90
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    The bottom line was you could import coal cheaper :o
    and no longer have the whole country held to ransom every winter

    Funny how King Arthur reminds me of Animal Farm by George Orwell



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